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Post by fazza on Oct 6, 2006 13:43:22 GMT
You may need to refer to a thread which started in June called "possible disqualification".
I have made it clear many times that the onus is on the captains to make sure I get results by the 5th of the month following completion of each two-month series of Inter-Area matches.
Those who receive the bulletins will have received their copy by now detailing all the results in Aug and Sept, and the arrangements which need to be made for the next series due to be played by November.
They will also see that, when the bulletin was issued (Oct 4th), one result was outstanding: Reading C v Northants C. I still issued the bulletin to avoid delaying every other captain involved but added a note to say that Reading and Northants had until the 5th (as per the rules) for me to receive the scoresheet.
Sounds like Neville Chamberlain here, but I have to say that no scoresheet has been received, and no phonecall, text or email has been received either (although Chamberlain never said that last bit).
In view of this, the result will not count towards the final Group 1 league table. As it happens, it will not make a great deal of difference as Wallingford C will qualify for the final anyway, but let it be known that my decision would have been the same even if it had cost any team a place in the final. I have no way of knowing at this stage who won the match, or indeed if any player made a high break.
I am aware that the 2nd leg was not played until the very last possible date (Sept 30th), but 5 days should be ample to send a card off and I would have accepted any other means of notification. I have said time and time again that, if any match is not being played until the last couple of days of the period, the captains should make absolutely certain that the result is received by any means available.
Please let this be a lesson to all Inter-Area captains for next year.
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Lolly
Distinguished Member
Chris Lawman
Posts: 578
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Post by Lolly on Oct 10, 2006 14:21:31 GMT
Have you spoken to the Captains of each team to make them aware of your desicion?
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Post by fazza on Oct 11, 2006 6:37:35 GMT
I have spoken to one, and I have learnt that the other already knows. The bulletin has been sent to each Secretary who is responsible for informing their respective captains. Both captains must know that they did not send the scoresheets in time, so it seems to me that enough of my time has been spent on people who cannot abide by rules. Enough warnings have been given, especially this year.
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Lolly
Distinguished Member
Chris Lawman
Posts: 578
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Post by Lolly on Oct 12, 2006 0:04:39 GMT
The reason for my question was due to the fact that the forum just recently has been used as a form of communication without taking consideration that some people do not have access to it. This is directed at many people and not just you Pete.
If Bar Billiards was a business then I would hate to see the profit books as there would be very few customers left. This forum cannot be used as an official form of communication, but it seems for some circumstances, that as soon as something is posted on here, then thats everyone informed and no more needs to be done. Anyway, thats another story.......
Both captians in this instance have failed to abide by the rules, fact. But in the current climate of bar billiards, would it not be better just to make a 2 minute phone call to remind the captains or at least one of them to get the result in? Bar Billiards is a dying sport and it is things like this that will prevent members of a team, finishing work at 6pm on a weekday, and having to rush around to do a 100+ miles round trip to get a match played before deadline date. Are players really going to be bothered?
I am not just saying this as it is a team from Northants, I am saying this as a whole. We have seen several issues of the past few month where common sence has not prevailed and people integrity has been bought into question.
At the end of the day, we all want bar billiards to survive and prosper. Lets all work together in trying to ensure that it does.
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Post by barbelman on Oct 12, 2006 5:32:57 GMT
At the end of the day, we all want bar billiards to survive and prosper. Lets all work together in trying to ensure that it does. Well said that man! Bar Billiards is not everyone's raison d'etre and people have a lot of other pressures in their lives like work, families, money and inate laziness. :D Therefore I would much rather make a 5p phone call to the secretary involved than have byes in the later stages of a competition. If the game has not been played at all then fair enough - chuck 'em out but........ Tony
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Post by fazza on Oct 12, 2006 6:35:18 GMT
My last Inter-Area bulletin warned that this would happen if captains continued to hang on to scoresheets, especially if they have decided to play the 2nd leg on the last possible date available. Each round is allowed two months to complete, so, if they choose this late course of action, the least they can do is to contact me in any way they wish the following day.
Even if they insist on relying on the Royal Mail, it should not take more than 2 or 3 days for the result to reach me, and they are allowed five days by the rules, so what's the problem? A phone call could easily have been made, yes. But that phone call should be made by the captain at fault, not by me.
Both captains have my contact details: one seems to phone me to register another player every few weeks, and the other has found it very easy to contact me when he wants assistance in running an Open.
It was even more important for me to have results in time this month as I needed to restrict the contact date more than usual for one of the C team matches so that both finalists were known by mid-November. That is why the bulletin was issued a day early without that result, but with the warning. The final will be played on Nov 25th or Dec 2nd.
The most amazing thing was that the Reading C captain was at the Ladies County Championships on Oct 1st, the day after the match was completed and he had not even mentioned the match to me. If I had realised this, I would have sorted it there and then. Even if he had not realised that I was going to be there, he only lives a stone's throw away and could have fetched the sheet or at least told me the result.
But it emphasises that it should be common practice for both captains to send in scoresheets, especially in the C team competition where the losing captain in this case should be "claiming" the four points for his team in the same way as the winner is claiming the six points.
Just one final point, although I announced this disqualification on this forum, it was not intended to be any "official" announcement, but I do not see the necessity for me to contact the captains over this when their league secretaries have been informed via the official bulletin. That is what the bulletin is for!
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Lolly
Distinguished Member
Chris Lawman
Posts: 578
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Post by Lolly on Oct 12, 2006 10:03:25 GMT
Not your fault, but our secretary is on holiday for 2 weeks and therefore this bulletin will not be received, read and distributed to the captians until his return.
I still feel that to improve our leagues and to keep the interest in bar billiards going, better forms of communication need to be used.
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Post by fazza on Oct 12, 2006 13:31:52 GMT
Not your fault, but our secretary is on holiday for 2 weeks and therefore this bulletin will not be received, read and distributed to the captains until his return. ......better forms of communication need to be used. Well I am glad it is not my fault.... but I do offer a service to send all bulletins to anybody for the paltry sum of £2.50 per YEAR, just covering postage. That way anyone can get automatic bulletins direct from me. Ian Jellis does this. I can also send the odd one to anybody INSTEAD of the Secretary if he informs me that he is going to be on holiday when it is due out. Charlie Gildersleve does this. I firmly believe this is as good as it gets. I have repeated over and over again that, if a match is not likely to be completed until the last day or so of a TWO MONTH period, the captain should take it upon themselves to contact me in any other way possible. What does he have to gain by sitting on a scoresheet for 3 or 4 days until he posts it? It now appears that (allegedly and apparently) Northants C are refusing to play their last match against Wallingford C in protest. I wonder how that would have gone down with other teams in the group if Wallingford still needed a few legs to qualify for the final. As it happens, they are already there. I only announced it on the forum as well as on the published bulletins as that is what the Inter-Area threads are for.
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Post by Kevin Pringle (R.I.P.) on Oct 12, 2006 13:49:35 GMT
It now appears that (allegedly and apparently) Northants C are refusing to play their last match against Wallingford C in protest. I wonder how that would have gone down with other teams in the group if Wallingford still needed a few legs to qualify for the final. A very good point Pete, and serious action would have had to be taken if that had been the case. Many people travel a long way through the comps and if all of this was undone by a non-result then it would seriously need to be looked at.
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