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Post by Q on Jun 13, 2009 23:42:14 GMT
For anyone who's interested here is a press report on their singles knockout competition. Here
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Post by Sparky on Jun 14, 2009 18:31:32 GMT
That has made me interested in just how different are our games, looking at the scores.
Pity it is so far away as I would love to go and witness this 'strange' related game ;D ;D remembering that there are some forum members who do, or have, played 4 pin :-* :-*
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Post by Chris_Sav on Jun 14, 2009 19:43:55 GMT
That has made me interested in just how different are our games, looking at the scores. Pity it is so far away as I would love to go and witness this 'strange' related game ;D ;D remembering that there are some forum members who do, or have, played 4 pin :-* :-* Was thinking exactly the same myself Graham. I'd love to go and have a look at their finals night, but it's soooooooooo far. Sav.
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BFG
Distinguished Member
Posts: 591
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Post by BFG on Jun 14, 2009 22:10:06 GMT
Probably worth the Journey!!
Quite respectable scores
Must say have really enjoyed watching and playing 4 pin....truly different game!
Still trying to figure out if it works on our wider tables. Seems ok but it still makes it slightly different ::) Would love to know about their tables.
If anyone feels ban the oxford shot is a good thing give this game a go!!
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Post by barbelman on Oct 26, 2010 12:33:05 GMT
I found a reference on facebook to the first game of the bar billiards season for the Thatchers Arms in Mount Bure near Colchester, Essex. Anyone know what league they play in? Too far from Kent I assume... www.thatchersarms.co.uk/index.htmlcheers Tony
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2010 12:55:05 GMT
Good find Tony. Some previous research I was doing on b/b venues in Essex reveals that they play the 4-pin version in the Sudbury & District League: www.sdbbl.co.uk/page/fixtures.htmlThe Five Bells are also from 'over the border'.
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Post by barbelman on Oct 26, 2010 13:48:46 GMT
Thanks Clive. I had seen Sudbury DBBL before but didn't remember it... Quite a strong little league by today's standards.
As you say it is 4 pin and I noticed one of their rules is; The player looses his/her entire score if :- 1. The last ball is holed without striking a cushion. That's an odd rule! ???
And they play with six whites rather than seven.
cheers Tony
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2010 14:21:23 GMT
..................also they have the 30s and the 10 round the other way (which actually makes better sense to me as the 10 is a 'difficult' hole concealed from view.
Tony, I'm transferring this thread to the Sudbury one on the "It's Bar billiards Jim" board for the sake of keeping it all together.
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Post by Carls421 on Apr 21, 2011 14:59:39 GMT
Hi guys, just a quick hello from us at the Norwich 4-pin BB League, we've just started on these forums so please bere with us..... We are made up of 4 pubs with 5 teams in the league, consisting of The Kings Head, The White Lion, The Golden Star (have 2 teams) and The Cottage (sister pub to The Brewery Tap in Sudbury) Anyway, would be good to keep in touch to iron out any rules etc we both play as we do have various q's we might need answering. Right, babbling over with, look forward to hearing from you!
Carl
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 24, 2012 14:09:06 GMT
hmm does anyone from Sudbury ever come here?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2012 16:34:34 GMT
hmm does anyone from Sudbury ever come here? I believe I'm right in saying that the League Chairman took out a Forum account last year, but he only visits as a guest and has yet to make a post.
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Post by BB Warrior on Dec 25, 2012 0:23:50 GMT
hmm does anyone from Sudbury ever come here? I believe I'm right in saying that the League Chairman took out a Forum account last year, but he only visits as a guest and has yet to make a post. One of the "silent majority" in the game then..... ::)
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 26, 2012 22:27:19 GMT
oh well I'm from the Sudbury league so there is one of us here :-)
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Post by BB Warrior on Dec 27, 2012 10:15:55 GMT
oh well I'm from the Sudbury league so there is one of us here :-) Great.... hello and welcome to the Forum. ;D I'm sure that I am not the one person on here that would like to find out more about both your League and the 4-Pin version of the game so perhaps you could give us some information.... number of teams, players, venues etc? ;) I know that Norwich are going to hold a 4-Pin "Open" next year.... will any of your players be entering that competition? Not having played 4-Pin personally, could you clarify one thing.... I know that the 200, 100 and 50 holes are the holes that are covered by the pins, but how far in front of the holes are the pins actually positioned? This question has been asked on the thread about the Norwich competition but, to the best of my knowledge, I don't think it was answered.... ??? Hope to hear from you soon. Best wishes, Dave
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 27, 2012 14:50:40 GMT
there are 11 teams in the Sudbury league at the moment spread across about 8 pubs.
If you take Sudbury as the base of the league the furthest we have to travel is about 16 miles
Each team consists of a minimum of 5 players and each match consists of 7 games, 2 doubles games followed by 5 singles plus before the match starts the captains of both teams play each other for points in the captains cup. I don't how the 3 pin leagues work but I guess it is along the same format.
The league is a friendly one now with an age range of 16 up to very old and has players of all types of experience
In our league the pins are placed in front of the 200, 100 and 50 holes and positioned so the base of each pin is around 4-5mm from the lip of the hole, thus meaning a shot that goes directly into the hole is ok but one the catches the lip and roles around will take the pin with it.
Looking at your scores it seems the 2 games are totally different. In a average game (that lasts around 15 minutes) a usual final score in our league is around 1500-2000. Our break shot is hard with the normal choice being to try and knock the red ball up the table into a 10 hole while the cue ball goes off the side cushion into a 50. It is possible the play the red up into the corner and back into the 200 for 400 points but it normally means the cue ball comes back towards the baulk line making safety the only choice for the next shot.
The last ball left on the table after the bar has dropped has to be played off a cushion into ANY hole. If it fails to touch a cushion the player loses his entire score, That rule was brought in many years ago to stop players just losing the last ball by playing directly into a hole on even worse just rolling it off the D with no attempt to pot it. The easiest shot for the last ball on a 4 pin table is into the top corner off 2 cushions and back into a 50 hole, but on our tables that runs the small risk of an over hit shot coming back, catching the lip of the 50 hole and then running round to take the black pin out.
I understand a couple of players from our league are intending to travel up to Norwich but it is the same old story, an entry fee, one and half drive plus almost certainly a night in a hotel (us Sudbury players like to drink) make it an expensive game of Bar Billiards.
By the way I myself have only started playing again after many years of retirement and don't even own a cue anymore
Dave
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2012 11:50:58 GMT
Hi Dave, First of all, welcome to the Forum, great to have another East Anglian correspondent. At the All-England Bar Billiards Association's AGM earlier this month East Anglia as an entity was granted a free year's unconditional associate membership. I believe this entitles Norfolk and Suffolk/Essex to send their champions to take part in the special national competitions which are run from September onwards, but no doubt the AEBBA Sec will be willing to elucidate. (I say Suffolk/Essex as I note the Sudbury League extends to across the county border.) As one of the 3-pinners winning to give the 4-pin version of the game a try at Norwich in March, I have been interested in the detail you have provided and have a couple of comments/queries to make: Looking at your scores it seems the 2 games are totally different. In a average game (that lasts around 15 minutes) a usual final score in our league is around 1500-2000. Our break shot is hard with the normal choice being to try and knock the red ball up the table into a 10 hole while the cue ball goes off the side cushion into a 50. It is possible the play the red up into the corner and back into the 200 for 400 points but it normally means the cue ball comes back towards the baulk line making safety the only choice for the next shot. This will be a culture shock for us 3-pinners! So a combination of back-spin and the 'reverse nap' on the cloth causes the ball to come back near to baulk ! I wonder how this will impact on Norwich 2013 which will utilise the AEBBA set of tables which are unlikely to be brushed 'back to front'? The last ball left on the table after the bar has dropped has to be played off a cushion into ANY hole. If it fails to touch a cushion the player loses his entire score, That rule was brought in many years ago to stop players just losing the last ball by playing directly into a hole on even worse just rolling it off the D with no attempt to pot it. The easiest shot for the last ball on a 4 pin table is into the top corner off 2 cushions and back into a 50 hole, but on our tables that runs the small risk of an over hit shot coming back, catching the lip of the 50 hole and then running round to take the black pin out. From this I take it the pins/mushrooms are not placed in any holes for the "last-ball shot" as they are in the 50s for 3-pin? So is it still possible to play the last ball into the 100, avoiding the standing pin, or is the shot found to be so difficult as to be inadvisable ? Cheers, tommo
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 28, 2012 14:57:47 GMT
hi Tommo yes all the pins are left standing. It is possible to play the last ball into the 100, but remember the 50 pins are slightly in the way if you come off the side cuchion so some side needs to be applied to the cue ball. If you need the 100 shoot it is easier to play the ball off the top cushion between the 20 and 30 hole (30 is the middle hole) with some side and roll back into the 100.
If the nap on your tables is front to back it will make scoring a little more difficult as on 4 pin tables most scoring shots, 50's, 100 and 200 are played off the top cushion and back into the holes, it will mean shots will need to be played a little harder to ensure the ball does not run off with the nap on the way back and reaches the hole.But to be honest it should not really effect things, a player should soon adapt. As for the break shot, if the table runs front to back it may well be possible to play red up the table into the corner and back to the 200 hole while stunning the cue ball across towards the side cushion leaving the chance of another 200 shot off that ball.
I would love to come up in March, but I cant commit myself until much nearer the time.
lol I could bring my Guinness Record bar billiards certificates with me and sign autographs
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curtd
Distinguished Member
Posts: 616
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Post by curtd on Dec 28, 2012 16:52:36 GMT
Guinness record certificate ?
And there was me thinking I was the only player still playing who had one of those 😄
Don't feel so special anymore 😄😄😄😄
Curt
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 28, 2012 17:47:24 GMT
i've been in the Guinness Book of Records 3 times for bar billiards, but it was long ago now i cant remember when it was
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Post by Carls421 on Dec 30, 2012 12:23:50 GMT
The last ball left on the table after the bar has dropped has to be played off a cushion into ANY hole. If it fails to touch a cushion the player loses his entire score, That rule was brought in many years ago to stop players just losing the last ball by playing directly into a hole on even worse just rolling it off the D with no attempt to pot it. The easiest shot for the last ball on a 4 pin table is into the top corner off 2 cushions and back into a 50 hole, but on our tables that runs the small risk of an over hit shot coming back, catching the lip of the 50 hole and then running round to take the black pin out. Really???? I didn't know you played the last shot like that??? When was that rule changed? and more to the point, why? I'm organising the East Anglian Open in Norwich but the rule for the final ball has stood for years and years, hence the reason for the hinges on the scoreboard in the first place, you mean you don't lower the scoreboard? or place the pins in the 50 holes? Sounds very bizarre? We'll need to get together and have a chat well before the Open to make sure there aren't any other major rule changes. :-/ Confused Carl
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 30, 2012 13:56:07 GMT
yes Carl the last ball has to be PLAYED off any cushion/s into ANY hole. All the pegs stay up and NO holes are covered.
That rule has been in place for,,,,, erm??????? I guess at least 20 years Even when I started playing over 35 years ago the last ball was sunk into any hole. Like I say the rule was changed to say you must hit a cushion first to stop the unsporting players just rolling the las ball straight down the 10 hole.
When is your next meeting about the open?
If I can work out how to do it on here I will email you my contact details
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Post by Carls421 on Dec 30, 2012 14:42:06 GMT
I know the final shot must always come off a cushion, and the rule about being unsporting by putting the ball down the 10 hole, and quite rightly so. But as I say, that was the whole reason for the scoreboard to be lowered, otherwise they wouldnt put a hinge on it don't you think? then the final ball to be played off the cushion, into either the 100 or 200 holes.
Next meeting is yet to be arranged after the festivities but i shall let you know.
Kind Regards
Carl
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Post by daveuk1 on Dec 30, 2012 15:38:51 GMT
lol i thought the score board just hinged down so you could put a cover on the table do the darts team could put their sandwiches on it plus it would be dam hard to do at our place, the scoreboard is screwed to wall.
BTW let me know if you need some mushrooms for the weekend, i could borrow the spare set from our pub and nik my brovs, he has a full size table at his home
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Post by daveuk1 on Jan 12, 2013 15:10:59 GMT
just incase anyone is even slightly interested I thought I would post the latest results for the Sudbury Bar Billiards League (just to let people know we are still going :) )
Edwardstone Wild Horses (4) v (3) Mill Green Pirates.Wild Horses (Capts)
Cornard Five Bells (2) v (5) Mauldons Adders.Mauldons Adders (Capts)
Saracens (5) v (2) Stanningfield Red House. Red House (Capts)
Bay Horse B (3) v (4) Hadleigh Eight Bells. Bay Horse B (Capts)
Brewery Tap (5) v (2)Thatchers Arms. Brewery Tap (Capts)
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Post by daveuk1 on Jul 22, 2013 12:37:49 GMT
Just to let you know that the Sudbury and District Bar Billiards League is still growing with the addition of another team for our 2013-14 season as Luke Cole-Watts is moving up to the Cornard Five bells to start up a second team. No more new pubs but at least it shows the number of players are steadily growing and Luke’s team includes a number of new young players.
Hats off to Luke for encouraging some new blood into the league, I just hope he doesn’t teach everything he knows to quickly and gives us mere mortals a chance to win a few games
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Post by Chris C (R.I.P.) on Jul 26, 2013 15:13:40 GMT
Hello people, I'm Chris a newly appointed member of this Forum and also from Sudbury, this makes me feel like a newly elevated Peer making his Maiden Speech in the House of Lords. Having read with interest the many comments on our league and rules, dating back to 2007 ish, I see that Dave has explained many there seems to be one misconception that we play 4 pin on narrow tables, in truth there is just 1 2ft 6" table (The Bay Horse) all other 7 venues (hosting 10 teams) have 3ft tables.
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Post by gandalf the untidy on Jul 26, 2013 16:09:52 GMT
Hi Kypps50
Nice to read a new poster, welcome to the forum, and look forward to seeing some 4 pin posts of match reports from Sudbury here
regs cs
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Post by daveuk1 on Jul 26, 2013 17:10:45 GMT
Hi Chris, glad to see you have finally made it here :-)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2013 19:59:34 GMT
Hi Chris, You've had a welcome from Gandalf, instigator of the new Eastbourne 4-Pin league: big welcome too from tommo, instigator of the new Crawley 4-Pin league. Both of us inspired by the first East Anglian Open and won over by your variation of the game.
Sudbury of course is the Daddy of the leagues and we here in Sussex are but in our infancy.
Of the other leagues, York is brand new and Norwich has only sprung up this century: Regarding your comment, Norwich also play on a mixture of table widths.
That leaves Wellingborough who are well-established, and who are reported as playing on long, narrow tables. And finally Gedney Hill who are based around the Fens/ The Wash region. They actually refer to 4-Pin as "Snookerette" and it is understood that the first Narrow tables were commissioned for their use and known as snookerette tables.
The wife and I looked in on the Bay Horse in March en route to Norwich. Nice pub.
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Post by Chris C (R.I.P.) on Jul 27, 2013 18:00:54 GMT
Thanks for the welcome and I read yourthread re visiting Bay Horse, if you have opportunity to visit our other venues you'll find them all welcoming and friendly. Now that a few of us are here I hope the discussions will be fruitful and helpful, as you're probably aware we are in contact with AEBBA re affiliation (our liasson being daveuk1) and we are actively in the throes of organising The East Anglian Open for 2014 which we're hoping will be a grat success with much help including people from here and AEBBA, look forward to chatting.
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