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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 22:40:26 GMT
From my Lincolnshire visit this week - The Red Lion in Market Rasen no longer has a BB table, they got rid of it when they went gastro, suggest delete from map The Dambusters Inn in Scampton however still has its table, albeit rather worn. I also thought it a really excellent pub and well worth a visit (review on PubsGalore site to follow) Thanks OldBlue, I have now started a thread on Lincolnshire and entered your findings accordingly. |
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 22:48:12 GMT
Thanks, it's actually a table of modern construction, a "Supreme". But as you say, it looks rather worn, suggesting a fair bit of use........so that can't be a bad thing in itself ! ;) |
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 22:50:56 GMT
So... how long have you been monitoring Facebook Clive?? ;) No. still not inclined to have anything to do with Facebook, Q. This was the process: Thought I'd follow up on this eBay movement: ....so I Googled "bar billiards Boston Lincolnshire" and that's what come up. No evidence yet of the one I was looking for, though. ;) |
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 22:54:01 GMT
Evidence of a 4-pin league based at Gedney Hill, Lincolnshire:
Four pin Alfred Sams & Sons tables at the Bell Inn, Murrow, and Butchers Arms, Parsons Drove. Apparently the Bridge Inn at Wisbech St Mary no longer has a table.  P1013594a by scrumpyboy, on Flickr Cheers, Mark Some information for me to disseminate from the above fixtures list as regards venues with tables, however as is quite often the case there seems to be an overlap in counties, with the prime venues in this case being over the border in Cambridgeshire ! :o
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Post by littlemark on May 2, 2013 7:51:57 GMT
The Six Ringers is in Leverington, the Black Bear a Wisbech pub. I may get to these today to have a look as I'm working locally. It's Snookerette in this league, a local suggested it was the 'length' of the table that differentiated it from BB, but I think it's more that the tables are all hired from the same place and are all manufactured by Sams.
Cheers, Mark
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2013 8:13:19 GMT
Hi Mark,
Any help you are able to give to de-mystify this hitherto-unknown league will be greatly appreciated !
I was informed the other day that such a 'snookerette' league did exist somewhere - a "ladies only" league -and maybe this is it !
The term 'Snookerette' is synonymous with bar billiards, and if the tables used are slightly longer and narrower, then that would indeed place it in the 4-Pin bracket - along with Sudbury, Wellingborough, Norwich and the newly-formed Eastbourne (summer-only) league. 8-)
Cheers,
tommo
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Post by littlemark on May 2, 2013 9:26:10 GMT
My understanding was that Jelkes registered the name Bar Billiards, and that other manufactures therefore had to devise other names for marketing their tables. Sams presumably chose Snookerette. The Gedney Hill league is definately not ladies only. The licensee of the Bell plays in the 'b' team and he's a bloke. I'm pretty sure he said that the Bell are current champions, and that the 'b' team currently have a stranglehold on the wooden spoon, proudly displayed beside the table. On a more general note, the Bell is a terrific boozer, run by a very welcoming ex-Londoner. The pub also has its own bowling green at the rear, being groomed ready for play at the start of the season this week. Elgoods ales, and as pleasant a place to spend an early evening watching the bowling as you're likely to find. There's a Shove Ha'penny too.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2013 10:45:39 GMT
The Bell certainly sounds a lovely pub with all the required attributes, and they have an excellent website: www.thebellinnmurrow.co.uk/Teams.htmlMy understanding was that Jelkes registered the name Bar Billiards, and that other manufactures therefore had to devise other names for marketing their tables. Sams presumably chose Snookerette. What you say about the term Snookerette is probably factual about the time of introduction in the 1930's and 1940's but does not have any real bearing in this day and age. Although indeed "Bar-Billiards Ltd" of Ascot were the major operator, dealing in Jelkes tables hire and maintenance, the term bar billiards has had a widespread usage and covers play on all other types of table - whether SAMS, Atlas, Padmores, Clares, Riley, Burroughes & Watts, even the modern Supreme tables that none of us seem to like ! In the late 1940s ex-football referee Ralph Tarratt introduced the game in Sussex (which has the most leagues by far of any county) and chose to deal with SAMS Bros of Hoddington Herts rather than Jelkes. He set up his own hire operation (which still exists to this day) and had a reciprocal arrangement with B-B Ltd that they would keep to their own patches so as not to be in direct competition with each other. In other words, Tarratts would not seek to hire outside Sussex. Accordingly, we play on standard-width SAMS tables down here, but at some stage (history not absolutely clear) it seems that SAMS Bros were commissioned to manufacture a batch of narrow (and slightly longer) tables for the 4-Pin version (sometimes known as Snookerette) to be played in the Fen district and East Anglia and possibly elsewhere. Until very recently it seemed that the very future existence of 4-Pin was under threat, with only two long-established leagues (Sudbury and Wellingborough, the latter one dwindling in numbers). Then four or five years ago the Norwich League sprang up out of nowhere and interest in 4-Pin has rocketed, with Norwich staging the very first 'East Anglian Open' in March this year, with 64 attendees - including 24 brave 3-Pinners who tried their luck at playing a totally alien version of the game they knew and loved ! So I would say that an already-established league based in Lincs/Cambs would be ideally placed to forge some links with its 4-Pin/Snookerette neighbours were it inclined to do so. |
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Post by littlemark on May 2, 2013 15:08:06 GMT
Here's the Winter League fixtures, some venues don't play in the Summer League (preferring a less pasty skin tone at a guess ;). The Plough is almost certainly the one at Holbeach St Johns, Snokerette ( sic) is mentioned, though not shown on an image of the games area on the pub website (http://www.theploughholbeach.co.uk/). These fixtures are pinned up above the table at the Black Bear, Wisbech.  P1013607a by scrumpyboy, on Flickr  P1013604a by scrumpyboy, on Flickr  Snookerette by scrumpyboy, on Flickr Cheers, Mark |
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2013 19:15:07 GMT
Excellent stuff, and thank you.
My first job now is to update the lists of league venues on the Cambridge board, and at the top of this page if in Lincs.
Then I'll pass whatever new information we have on to Barbelman with a view to having the AEBBA map of all known venues in this country updated.
tommo
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2013 19:30:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2013 23:26:59 GMT
I think it's quite likely that the Plough at Holbeach St Johns is in the Gedney Hill & District Snookerette League. As I mentioned elsewhere: 'The Plough is almost certainly the one at Holbeach St Johns, Snokerette (sic) is mentioned, though not shown on an image of the games area on the pub website (http://www.theploughholbeach.co.uk/).' The Plough at Great Casterton has been closed and up for sale for a few months now, and has never had a BB table to my knowledge. Quite a distance from the Gedney Hill area anyway. Cheers, Mark Further attention needed to the list at top of this thread (will have to wait till the morning due to the late hour ! tommo |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2013 21:33:17 GMT
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Post by barbelman on Jun 2, 2013 6:11:54 GMT
What a smashing article/blog and a fascinating bit of BB history. Thanks Tommo... ;D Tony |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2013 11:30:39 GMT
I think we have our new Forum member Little Mark to thank for the article, Tony - as well as for the very discovery of the existence of the Gedney Hill & Dist. Snookerette League. ;D
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Post by BigPhilMac on Jun 2, 2013 14:54:03 GMT
I think we have our new Forum member Little Mark to thank for the article, Tony - as well as for the very discovery of the existence of the Gedney Hill & Dist. Snookerette League. ;D Maybe they should be annexed into the association, and have the Lincoln open ;D ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2013 17:24:01 GMT
Maybe they should be annexed into the association, and have the Lincoln open ;D ;D That could be a good topic to start for discussion. At the 2012 AEBBA AGM a free affiliation was granted to East Anglia in general as associate members. Thus the 2013 Open was able to count as a ranking event. The question now is, how will this develop ? Co-operation now exists between the comparatively recently-formed Norwich league and the long-established Sudbury League, and either could host the Open in 2014. These are the two 'prime' 4-pin leagues, both have their own websites. I get the impression that Wellingborough and the newly-discovered Gedney Hill & District operate on a less serious level, and it would be up to them if they wanted to raise their profile and have a piece of the action. :-/ |
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Post by Coleman Jnr on Oct 8, 2013 7:37:21 GMT
A friend recently visited the Dambusters Inn in Scampton Lincs, and he was telling me they have a table in there..... Something for someone to check out if they are ever close. Billiards and a history lesson to be had by all!
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Post by barbelman on Oct 8, 2013 10:53:30 GMT
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Post by Coleman Jnr on Oct 8, 2013 12:06:23 GMT
To be honest Tony I hadn't checked, I wonder if it ever gets played and if they actually play it correctly!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2013 14:56:34 GMT
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Post by Coleman Jnr on Oct 8, 2013 16:28:56 GMT
They probably don't realise its worth, surprised we haven't formed a RSPCBBT (Royal Society for Prevention against Cruelty to Bar Billiards Tables) poor table sitting in a corner unloved and unused! It could be revamped and have the worlds best putting 20,000 worth of balls down it! :)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2013 16:56:07 GMT
I like the sentiment, but the reality is that four-pin is more likely to be played on it as it falls within Gedney Hill Snookerette League territory.
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oldblue
Junior Forum Member
Posts: 36
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Post by oldblue on Apr 26, 2014 10:32:47 GMT
Alas, my visit to the Dambusters last Monday found the BB table on its side against the wall, and a dining table where it had been. The landlord told me he now needed the space and was going to put it on eBay.
Still a great pub though.
OB
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2014 12:30:17 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2015 21:42:25 GMT
...and a further one in Snookerette territory:
(4-PIN NON-LEAGUE) LOUTH TOWN AND COUNTRY CLUB, CANNON STREET, LOUTH, LINCS LN11 9NL
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Post by barbelman on Apr 20, 2015 6:03:22 GMT
...and a further one in Snookerette territory: (4-PIN NON-LEAGUE) LOUTH TOWN AND COUNTRY CLUB, CANNON STREET, LOUTH, LINCS LN11 9NL No peg in front of the 100 pocket?? :/ |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2015 8:48:04 GMT
No peg in front of the 100 pocket?? :/ Ah, but that's only practice before a tournament, Tony..... I sometimes prepare for a rare foray into 3-Pin with no pegs on the table at all: I find they only get in the way !  |
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Post by barbelman on Apr 20, 2015 9:24:29 GMT
No peg in front of the 100 pocket?? :/ Ah, but that's only practice before a tournament, Tony..... I sometimes prepare for a rare foray into 3-Pin with no pegs on the table at all: I find they only get in the way ! But..but..why would they? (and they've got very dirty balls!) ;) |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2015 12:00:32 GMT
LOL If you're going to be picky, the mushrooms seem mighty close to the pockets: maybe they're practicing for next year's E.A.Open ?  |
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