dipper
Distinguished Member
Posts: 829
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Post by dipper on May 23, 2011 17:31:41 GMT
Hi, after going though all the Sussex leagues home web sites ;) and seeing all these great champions, how about ressurecting the Champion of Champions competition.
It was always a terrific competition, with the best players from around the county, I am sure sombody still has the trophy somwhere!
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2011 19:06:03 GMT
Well said, Roger,
Put it forward at this year's AGM and I'm sure you will get a seconder.
Dave Ingram, Nigel Senior and myself are known advocates for the return of this great competition. KT and Lady H have also expressed a passing interest, though it was long since gone when they came to these regions.
IMHO the competition ran successfully all the time it was held at a suitable pub as an evening knockout. In those days, though, it was run by a separate body, the Sussex Bar Billiards Charity Association. The Cups were the George Lanaway (for men) and Cynthia Bostock (for ladies).
Eventually when it became economically unviable to continue, the SCBBA took it on but expanded the format to a complicated group system, making it an all-day event. This served to detract from the spectator point of view, especially holding it on a Sunday when those in work could miss out on a day's pay at double time.
So if it is to be resurrected, some very careful thought would have to go into how to give it back some of its allure. :-/
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Post by davejones on May 23, 2011 20:21:46 GMT
I echo the sentiments above and need looking at the AGM.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2011 21:02:00 GMT
I am sure sombody still has the trophy somwhere! There's a lot about it here: www.horshambarbilliards.co.uk/page2.html........and even a photo of the Perpetuals (second clipping down) if that helps......... |
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Post by JB on May 24, 2011 8:46:29 GMT
This was discussed last year and if you look on page 2 of SCBBA pages there was a lot said about this competition including my thoughts.
Personally I think there are enough competitions. With the mens doubles plate, mixed doubles, Captains and Seniors now seemingly established competitions do we really need the expense of more!
Having played in the Champion of Champions many times it really only worked when it was played as a one day competition (Inter-league weekend when there wasnt B teams playing). As soon as it was changed to home and away it turned into a nightmare and I think (could be wrong) that the last year it was played it wasnt completed as so many players didnt bother playing there matches.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2011 9:56:33 GMT
Having played in the Champion of Champions many times it really only worked when it was played as a one day competition (Inter-league weekend when there wasnt B teams playing). As soon as it was changed to home and away it turned into a nightmare and I think (could be wrong) that the last year it was played it wasnt completed as so many players didnt bother playing there matches. One-Day competition was Guise 2 and Home/Away Guise 3. Guise 1 was best, but as I said, that was when a separate organisation ran it. I agree that SCBBA have enough on your plate with running the competitions that you have already, both in terms of organising time and expenses regarding trophies: I was trying to drop a subtle hint that if this competition were to return it would have to be delegated out to a Third Party (evening venue?) to run and would have to pay its own way. |
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Post by JB on May 24, 2011 10:08:17 GMT
Guise 1 (evening in a pub) - How long ago was this format played. I can only ever remember it being played as a 1 day event and I first won it in 82/83.
The only competition I can remember like this that was pkayed in a pub was the Southern Counties
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2011 14:33:16 GMT
Well the competition was started in 1970/71 and to answer your question the last time it was held in a pub must have been around 1980/81. I can remember the Beach Hotel Littlehampton, and later the John Seldon, Worthing staging the event.
I note from some old programmes I have kept that it was held on a Saturday in 1983 at Horsham YMCA but as a simple knockout (you beat Margaret Coble in the Final) but by the 1985 competition (on a Saturday at Horsham British Legion) it had been switched to a format with two qualifying groups (you beat Jan Bithell in the final that year).
It was held at the Excess (L & E) Club Worthing in 1988 and Alfold Social Club in 1990. By 1997 (the last time I qualified) it had been switched to the Downview as a regular arrangement, and the ladies played all-play-all and the men the same but in two groups (with Jim Millward beating Barry Timson in the Final). Kim Beeching won the Ladies that year with Jan Bithell runner-up.
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dipper
Distinguished Member
Posts: 829
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Post by dipper on May 30, 2011 17:07:33 GMT
Have e-mailed Nigel with the posibility of reinstating Champion of Champions competition, it will be brought up at the AGM, I hope there will be support for this, and looking at this board so far there is a positive response.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2013 9:18:17 GMT
I know I have carped on about it before but is there any chance or any space in next years calender to re-incarnate the Champion of Champions.Such a great competiton as you have to win your own league singles before you can even enter it. Worth considering? Please come along and fight your case Roger... i know you mentioned it last year but didnt show to fight for your reasons for it. To help Roger's cause, I have tagged this reminder on to the original Champion of Champions thread - which should 'bump' it back into visibility (was in danger of being lost amongst all the other Sussex threads down on page 4)tommo |
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Post by BB Warrior on May 18, 2013 10:09:14 GMT
To help Roger's cause, I have tagged this reminder on to the original Champion of Champions thread - which should 'bump' it back into visibility (was in danger of being lost amongst all the other Sussex threads down on page 4)tommo I did put a reminder about this on the thread for the proposals for the Sussex AGM as Roger had raised the subject on there a little while ago.... however nobody has actually seconded the proposal. ::) Personally I would like to see this competition return, however I am reluctant to second it for a number of reasons:- Firstly, I don't know how it could be fitted into the calender without requiring an individual date for itself and therefore the extra costs of hiring tables etc which would put a financial burden on to Sussex County. :-/ The only other options would either be to run it at the end of an existing competition day.... either the Sussex Doubles or one of the One Day Inter League Competitions, which would mean a very long day for both the competitors and the organisers of those events.... or to have the matches played at neutral venues in the same way that the Sussex Mixed Doubles, Captains Cup and Over 50's competitions are played at present. :-X If I am honest, I am not sure that there would be the support from players to justify running the competition (which I believe is one of the reasons it discontinued in the past?) and we could find that the "same faces" would be at the competition most of the time. I also have a slight concern that introducing this again would diminsh the value of the Sussex Singles, which is the current "flagship" individual competition in Sussex and is always well supported with 50 plus entries every year and would not want to see that happen. 8-) However, if somebody could provide a viable way that this could be run without impacting any of the above I would probably vote in favour of bringing it back.... as long as the proposal gets seconded of course! ::) ;D |
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2013 10:48:21 GMT
At face value, this would be a desirable competition from the point of view of being a natural progression up from the grass roots level of League up to competing as League Champion on the county stage. For example, Sam Short has just won the Billingshurst Singles in only her second season: where does she go from there ? It would be nice to give the answer "you have qualified to play in the Sussex Champion-of-Champions competition against the champions of all the other leagues!"
However......as Warrior points out, there are both financial and logistic implications and the competition would have to be self-funding. Good point.
When the Champion-of-Champions was successfully run in the past, it was under the auspices of a completely separate body from the SCBBA: the Sussex Bar Billiards Charity Association, and not only did the books get balanced, but those blue charity collection boxes were handed round to each pub at the start of the season, with hundreds of pounds being raised for the beneficiary (St Catherine's Hospice). The competition was held in a nice pub as an evening event, with admission charged and a raffle held, which AFAIK is how any trophies and perpetual cup engraving was funded.
Eventually interest dwindled and one year it ran at a loss, which meant it was no longer sustainable, the SCBBCA was accordingly disbanded. The SCBBA kindly agreed to take it on, and ran it for a couple more years as 'just another Sussex competition' but by then it had lost its appeal and was confined to "Dead Competitions Heaven".
I'm afraid it's a sign of the times that bar billiards has taken on a 'professional' aspect: competitions are tailored to do no more than break even, the lions share of entry fees going on the table hire and winners' prizes, and with nothing left over for charities. :'(
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