Is this coaching

[milko]

A player who most of us knows that plays in the Wallingford league and has eye problems (tunnel vision) was on a good break when he left a ball behind a hole, he couldn't see it properly so he asked his team mate who was marking how far it was from the hole and he let him know. This infuriated his opponent who says he wont be playing any more in the summer league.

Do you think this is coaching or not. ?

If it is, should the marker have told him because of his eye condition or gone by the rules. ?

What are your views on this. ?




Keith.

[Herr von Puebik]

Doesn't sound like coaching to me Milko

[Colemanator]

Nor me.

[SirKT]

Of course it`s not coaching ::)

The player with the poor eyesight (who most people in the Oxon leagues know), has been playing for over 25yrs, maybe more. His eyesight has got steadily worse, and the fact that he can and wants to still play the game is an achievement in itself.
Even if he was told how far the ball was away from the hole, he`s still got to hit it ???
I don`t know who the player in question is that complained but he really does need to think again. Would he rather the offending player walk round the table to judge the distance himself and then incur the wrath of his opponent for time wasting?
I and plenty of other top players have lost to this person in recent years.
I for one am pleased to see him still out there giving his best.

I thought most summer leagues were supposed to be friendly & bring the gulf between top & lower division players closer together with handicaps. ;)

[Chris_Sav]

It's not coaching from the information available.

If I have a ball tight in the corner I will nearly always ask how far it is off the cushion, so that I can avoid a double kiss if possible.

It's no different to bowls where the players frequently ask the ref for distance from the jack. It saves the time of the player going for a close look!!

Sounds highly petty to me

This opinion is given without prejudice and not knowing the full circumstances or the players involved.

[Mark James]

If that constitutes coaching I reckon I could get a job as bowling coach for a cricket team....

"It's 22 yards away." Job done.

[Kevin Pringle (R.I.P.)]

How can it be coaching ?

It is like asking what colour is the ball, you still have to play the shot !
How the distance is determined is irrelevant unless another player tells him how to play the shot, in which case it is then coaching.

Well said Kevin and Chris.

Sorry Keith this is an example of prejudice that is creeping into our game from players who expect everyone to play at 1500+/minute. The player in question has reasons for the way he plays and does it well considering his condition.

Secondly considering his team mate was chalking then it had to be on a known Wallingford table I presume, in which case it would be impossible for him to get into a position to see.

I would like to know who complained, but can probably guess :(

Of course it's not coaching. It's the same as asking the marker how many do I need to win ? after the bar has gone.

Coaching is being told how to play a shot, ie where to aim for, what side to put on it etc.

[milhouse]

I think Tommo has hit the nail on the head with this one, it is no different to asking how far behind/in front you are in the scores.

verdict - not coaching.

ps - what are your views Milko ? do you think its coaching ?

[milko]

I must admit that when I was told about this last night my reaction was slightly different to all of you, but after reading your comments I must admit to being wrong with what I said at the time.

I now agree with all of you and consider it within the rules to ask this sort of question.

Kevin T's comments were right, in that it is good to see him still playing after all these years with such a problem.

Kevin P, I didn't say anything about the speed of the player involved or
his opponent.





Keith.

[Sparky]

Only just had a chance to catch up but would completely agree that coaching is when you tell someone HOW to play i.e. what shot to play, and this doesn't seem to be the case from your report Keith.

[petetheplumber]

think every one knows my veiws on coaching HOWEVER regardless of the quality of any ones eyes if THEY think they can see well enough to play then no leniency should be showed on that point. At end of the day the player has got to judge the distance himself. By someone telling him the distance the player has still gotta judge it blindly in his head and rely on good information. SO NO ITS NOT COACHING its just speeding the game along.

[Kevin Pringle (R.I.P.)]

milko said:

Kevin P, I didn't say anything about the speed of the player involved or his opponent.

I know that Keith, and apologize if implied, but it is typical of the comments that get thrown at him, even some Wallingford players in the past have said he should 'chuck it in', or he is deliberately playing slow etc., if they really knew him they would realize that he cannot even recognize someone like me who he has known for 25 years without very carefully looking at them.

Personally my opinion is if someone says they will quit the game because of players like the player mentioned or a one armed player then the game is better off without them. I have now quit the game, but the game need all the players it can find without being prejudiced towards a few who try their best and produce good results.

No offence meant personally to you Keith.

Not coaching. Of course.

[Martin Pellett]

of course this is not coaching.

KP as to your comment on one armed players, being one of the only one armed players around (I've never met another one),I have never encountered any discrimination in bar billiards only support and I agree that we do not need players who would complain about players with disabilities.