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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 17:16:06 GMT
This topic received an airing prior to the 2010 AGM but became mixed in with different discussions on the same thread, so I will do my best to extricate it: ... to me the solution is obvious. The County must restore the Champion-of-Champions Competition which was last staged in 2001/2002. You already have the Trophies for it, with engraving dating back to 1970/71. This rewards the winners of the ten individual leagues in Sussex by allowing the reigning singles champions to 'go forward' to play in a knockout tournament to decide............the Champion of champions. There is then an incentive to earn the right to play in this by qualification. No arbitrary 'I'll give it a go' and then withdraw at the last minute which tends to happen in an ordinary open singles. There will be those who will say that the competition dwindled down to nothing and had to be discontinued. But that was because the original format was meddled with and the competition drawn out into a full day with a complicated system of round robin and group qualification. It worked much better as a simple knockout competition, played off in one evening at a nice pub. I'm not sure that re-introducing the Champion of Champions Trophies would be the "solution"...... with so many players now playing in multiple Leagues many of the "champions" would prove to be the same players...... Jean won the Ladies Singles in Brighton & Worthing and I won the Mens Singles in Lewes & Mid-Sussex last year to give just 2 examples. ;D So, all we would end up with would be an "elite" competition for a few players...... when surely we should be encouraging more people (of all standards) to be playing and trying the competitons? So - and I am trying to help here, so please don't dismiss this before it's had a chance to be aired - it seems logical to allow these top ladies - and the up and coming ones who've just won their League's Singles title - like Jenny Edwards who is Horsham Champ, Diesel who is Billingshurst Champ etc - to qualify by right to play in the Champion-of-Champions................ along with the elite. BTW, your comment 'many champions would be the same person' is a red herring, Dave, there was a tried and tested format which lasted for 30 years. If one champion qualified twice, they could surrender the slot of their choice and allow the runner-up to represent the League instead. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 17:25:07 GMT
(continued).... I wasn't aware of that having only been playing since 2006, so the Champion of Champions was before my days! ;D ;D I would suggest that maybe you should contact Nigel, who is General Secretary of SCBBA, and ask him to add it on to the Agenda for the Sussex AGM which will give it the chance for all those that attend to give their views....... it would certainly receive my support - for what that is worth! ::) ;D Thanks for that Dave and I certainly agree with you that this provides food for thought and possibly subject material for discussion at the AGM. My motives for flagging this up now really stem from all the research I am doing on past County and Interleague history, and it has become apparent to me anyway that the county is all the poorer for the loss of these great competitions. KT, who is proposing new events, is probably not even aware that they ever existed, as would anyone entering recently into Sussex circles. All the more reason for adding a proper "Hall of Fame" section to the Sussex website. We have actually aired the topic of 'bringing back the Champion-of-Champions Competition' before on here, and I remember that Nigel was supportive at the time, having appeared in the last-ever Final (2001-2) when being of limited experience - and losing out to John Slee. I gained the impression that he would love to have a second chance at winning the event.............. ;) Just a few comments from me which are my own personal feelings. Not going to do quotes coz they never seem to work for me! 2. Champions of Champions.- Not sure im right but i think this changed to a home and away basis for the following reason. It was originally played on the inter-league weekend before the introduction of the B team comp which meant there was a spare day. There used to be 9-10 men and 7-8 ladies and was played in groups. No way could you play this amount of games in a nice pub on only one or two tables. Hiring the tables needed just means a lot more expense and finding a venue big enough. The home and away was only played for a couple of years. The main reason it stopped was because as usual a lot of players didnt bother arranging there matches. The first year it was played i played my home and away leg then waited 2 months before i knew who i was playing in the next round.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 17:30:49 GMT
continued... The idea of restoring the Champion-of-Champions would be to encourage entries from further afield - by putting extra kudos into winning their own league's singles title thus qualifying for a more prestigious event. Times change, and what worked in 1990 might not have worked in 2000, but who's to say it couldn't work again in 2010, especially as we still have ten leagues in Sussex ? In the case of the Champion of Champions, I remember the last time this was held - Lorraine had won both the Horsham ladies and the Mid-Sussex title, she elected to represent Horsham, which left me (as runner-up) to represent Mid-Sussex, which I willingly did (it was on a home and away basis and, after winning my first round, I played home and away against Kim Beeching and happily travelled to Hastings) The following year, when I won the Mid-Sussex title, I was more than happy to have another go - but I was told there was no support for it. Having not been on here for some months I thought I would just scan some bits of interest and this Champion of Champion sounds interesting, not sure I have heard about it before?!? Would it involve just Sussex Champions or does the net throw further to other Counties? Hi Hayley, You can read something about the old Champion-of-Champions competition here: www.horshambarbilliards.co.uk/page2.html(I have been doing a lot of research recently on Horsham League history as this season will be our 60th Jubilee) The C-of-C was discontinuted about 9 years ago and was originally run, for charity, by a separate autonomous organisation known as the Sussex Bar Billiards Charity Association. Mention of the scale of funds raised is quoted in the extract. The running of the competition was eventually taken on by the SCBBA, but then it suddenly came to an abrupt halt. The excuse given at the time was that insufficient players turned up, but I was later told that I could have played for it representing Billingshurst - but was not informed when it was due to take place !
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 17:40:00 GMT
continued........... A rule change was agreed at the AGM just to cover the champion of champions not being a current event, as the rules at present cover that competition and not the Watney Mann or our current County Champion via the singles representing Sussex at the nationals. Also a claification rule covering competitions still played over 3 legs. Tommo, this sounds good to me especially if it is all for charity. Maybe if it hasn't run for 9 years, it could be resurrected for its 10th year?? 2011?? Well, Hayley, according to TJ (in the post just before yours) mention of the Champion-of-Champions has just been removed from the SCBBA Rules in acknowledgment of its failure to exist for 9 years. Unfortunately I couldn't make the AGM, so don't know what was discussed, but it sounds as if the subject did get an airing ! Tommo The Champion of Champions TJ referred to was actually the Watney Mann that was discussed and in that the Sussex rules it still referred to league champions only being invited which is not the case anymore. Unfortunately the Champion of Champions was not discussed, but I do agree Tommo, that this was a great competition held since the 1970's and would be worth resurrecting if we could a) get the tables (I only feel it could be done as a one day event) and b) we could all league represented and most of them being the current league champions. Sad to realise it is now 10 years since this was last held |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 17:46:03 GMT
Just to keep the theme of the old C-of-C competition going, this really was a great competition in its heyday, and I have turned up a transcript of the 1988 competition which was held at the London & Edinburgh SSC Worthing in conjunction with an Under 22's (won by Dave Simmons, Runner-up Stephen Bungard).
Not sure what day of the week it was held on, but play commenced at 3.30pm and total playing time was 5 and a half hours.
These were the competitors:
Men: Peter Gibbs (Billingshurst); Colin Smith (Brighton); Steve King (Crawley); Peter Cox (Eastbourne); Paul Chatfield (Hastings); Terry Race (Horsham); Ric Bithell (Lewes); Dave Hampton (Littlehampton); Chris Ellmers (Mid Sussex); Neil Martel (West-Sussex); Roger Taylor (Worthing).
Ladies: Lyn Draper (Billingshurst); Ros Rees (Brighton); Sheelagh Hale (Crawley); Kim Beeching (Hastings); Linda Turvey (Horsham); Jan Bithell (Lewes); Clare Moyle (Littlehampton); Angela Knapman (Mid Sussex); Gillian Woolley (West-Sussex); Sheila Pinner (Worthing).
As the C-of-C wasn't mentioned at the AGM, I have split the relevant posts away from the AGM thread and made this into a new topic. - tommo
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