Beginner needs help!

[gizmocom]

Dear all,

I am new to this forum and have a lot of questions! I hope this is OK! I have recently made the space in my house to put together and play my Jelkes 'Threepenny' table I bought about 2 years ago from ebay.

I live in Exeter, Devon and play snooker and pool regularly (to a reasonable standard), but have always had a fascination for bar billiards. I have played on a few local tables nearby over the years, all which have now disappeared, but have never seen anybody play who actually knows what they are doing, so it is a big learning curve for me! I hope to be able to come to a league match or tournament in the future to see how the game is really played, as I think I would learn a lot from this, but I hope people might be able to help me out with some questions I have in the meantime.

I have a load of questions in my head about the table itself, the rules and scoring techniques, but I will just start off with the few most pressing ones!

1) The cushions on the sides of my table seem to change consistency when they get near the end of the table. It starts from about level with the 100 hole. The cushion is firmer in these areas and gives less bounce. The table was newly covered when I bought it, but feeling underneath the cushion does not seem to have been joined. I have not noticed this before on other tables I have played on, so is this normal? and if so, what is the reason behind it?

2) Is anyone (scorer/referee/team mate/yourself) allowed to push the balls down the hole, when spinning, to speed up the game? If not, is it a foul if you play whilst the ball hasn’t dropped, or just if you contact it whilst playing? I.e. can you play down the other side of the table whilst the ball drops?

3) When scoring, is it normal to miss the 0 off of the end of the score? I have noticed that members of this board sometimes refer to scoring with single digits, (i.e. 73) but as this is possible I presume it’s actually 730.

4) Does anyone know if there is any video available of anyone playing BB? Either online or other formats would be great. I just think this might be a great way for me to learn and pick up tips. Have any of the world championships ever been recorded?

And lastly … for now!

5) What is the standard shot to play when a ball is stuck in the corner of the table near the 30 hole? I have had some success playing hard and double kissing the cue ball into the 50, which usually releases the ball from the corner as well, but I guess this is risky. I have more success by playing slow and hitting the cushion first and then coming off the face of the ball in the corner into the 30 hole, but this has to be pretty slow so the ball usually stays in the corner, giving the same problem again!

I am sorry for the length of this post, but as you can tell I have a lot to learn!!

Many thanks,
Darren Smith

[milhouse]

I can answer a couple of these.
2 - If a ball is rolling around a pocket, nobody is allowed to touch it and you are not allowed to carry on playing until the ball has disappeared down the hole.
3 - It is common practice to miss off the 0 when scoring, it makes things a lot easier !
4 - I understand there is a chap who plays in the Eynsham league by the name of Andy Wilson who is making or has made some kind of video about this game. Its the only one i have heard on, but then i have only been playing 2 years myself.
Maybe Pete Farrelly is the best person to answer these questions.

[Colemanator]

point 5, standard shot is cushion first. your object ball may be sticking for a number of reasons, poor cushions, baize, unlevelness.

chimp said:

point 5, standard shot is cushion first. your object ball may be sticking for a number of reasons, poor cushions, baize, unlevelness.

Agree with all answers so far, and to add to the last comment above, a lot of tables have a triangular cut-away in the corners - and I have known ones which haven't been fitted right, making the gap too big and the ball therefore sticking in the corner. Otherwise the answer is as the Colemanator said, and as a guide aim on the side cushion about an inch in front of the ball playing across it and both balls should go down, one in the 30 and one in the 20 pocket.

[fazza]

Help is our middle name!!!!

1. Your cushions bother me. I am definitely not the table construction expert on the forum, that is Chris Saville, but are they fully screwed on? Some rubber may have been missed out when it was recovered. This is definitely not normal.

2. answered correctly: Do not touch or assist your balls!

3. Yes, much easier to score without the 0. If you get to 950 and then score another 200, it is announced as "95" and then "15 over 1". The recommended way is then to indicate 1000 on an extra line of the scoreboard (if you have a 4 line one) or place a coin or marker on the table for each 1000. If you then score another 150, you can forget about the 1 for a while and just say "30". Once you get it, it is much, much easier.

4. Yes, there are videos but I do not know if they are commercially available. You can email me or PM me for any tips, and many others on this forum, I am sure.

5. This is tricky because I think this depends on the speed of your table. If your table is not too slow, the best way is to play at the side cushion first in such a way that the cue ball just edges across the face of the object ball. The cue ball will be very likely to go in the 20, and the object ball should at least come out of the corner. Too many players play at the cushion too close to the ball and it will double kiss and the ball stays there. I will give away one little secret though, as long as you do not tell anybody else. Nobody else is listening are they? Play the shot with the cue ball in the opposite edge of the D. (That is, if the ball is in the LH corner, play from the extreme RH edge of the D). This gives maximum angle off the cushion and is more likely to score.
If, however the table is slow, your blast way to double kiss may well be the best as my usual shot will not move it out the corner very much.

The main thing is to have fun Darren, and do try to get to some of our tournaments! I will give you a diary of events if you want them. We are at Reading for different events every Sunday exc Oct 15th for the next 6 weeks and then again some more Sundays in late November (usually from about noon till early evening). Or there are the World Championships in Jersey on November 10-12, you can catch a plane direct from Exeter, or start swimming now....

[gizmocom]

Thanks to everyone for your replies, thats great!

I think I need to get my cushions looked at then, as this is probably the reason why I am having problems getting the ball to come out from the corner!

I have looked at the table again and the cushions are fine up to the same point on each side, so that is why I thought it could have been like that on purpose. In trying to feel what is there under the baize, it seems like it might be just wood (but with the 'ledge' underneath) as there is no give in it at all. Also one of the corners is fine where the cushions meet, but the other side has a gap and is not level properly. If I only hit the cushion one inch before the object ball then it would nearly hit it full in the face!

I am guessing that the person who recovered it did not have much experience with BB tables. They have done a good job with the cloth on the bed though. I think they might have either used something other than BB cushions and 'made' the rest!, or just recovered what was wrongly there in the first place.

Is checking the cushions for tightness and possibly replacing the rubber something that I might be able to do myself? I know you can get replacement cushions online, but have no idea if this is something I should be trying to attempt! If not, how much am I likely to pay to have the cushiond redone, and will I have to send my table somewhere to be looked at? as I don't know if there will be anyone with a lot of experience local to me. Dismantling it again would be a major being a major pain!

One other thing I wanted to ask about my table is that there is a bit of damage in a couple of places to the wood, with part of the 'beading' decoration around the top damaged in places. If I wanted to get this repaired in the future, would it be better to get it looked at by a table specialist, or a antiques restorer?

Many thanks again for all you help with the other question, I will defeinetly try to get to a tournament soon, but would love to track down that video.

Cheers,
Darren

[Chris_Sav]

Hi,

Been up to my neck in other things and only heard about this Sunday.

Re the cushions, Is it the same both sides?? What about the end nearest where you stand?? is that soft or hard??

My initial suspicion is that the cushions have been put on the wrong way around. Jelkes tables normally have rubber for three quarters of the cushion and wood for the remaining quarter. The hard end should be at the front so that it covers the area over the leatherette which is not used. Try swappng the side cushions and seeing if this cures it. It would not be the first time I have encountered this.

Chris.

[fazza]

Sounds extremely likely to me, too

[gizmocom]

Hi, Sorry for the delay, but I was in Denmark for a couple of days.

Yes, it seems that that is the answer, thanks! I checked and the cushions are soft at the end you play from, so I will attempt to swap them round in the next day or two. I am guessing that the cushions are bolted on, so it should be pretty straightforward to swap the sides?

It seems so obvious now that I can't beleive I didn't think of it! You have definetly saved me a costly call out for someone to check it.

Thanks very much to Chris, Pete and everyone else who as replied. I am looking forward to getting even more enjoyment out of my table and should hopefully not have so much problem with the corners now!

thanks again,
Darren

[Chris_Sav]

Good news!!

The cushions are kept on by the normally black domed head screws down the side.

Be careful with these, most refurbishers us 2" screws which are not long enough 2¼" are needed but difficult to get. If the holes do not match and they are 2", drill a small pilot hole and do not overtighten.

Chris

[gizmocom]

Hi everyone,

I swapped the cushions around last night with no problems. It still had the original screws and they fit a lot better now.

I don't think they were tightened properly before either, as the bounce off of them now is much truer and I don't get the same problems with the corners now.

I know it plays much better now as on my first go I got my highest break and ran the clock out in two visits! This is far better than anything I have been able to acheive before!

thanks again for the excellent advice,
Darren

[Chris_Sav]

gizmocom said:

I know it plays much better now as on my first go I got my highest break and ran the clock out in two visits! This is far better than anything I have been able to acheive before!

thanks again for the excellent advice,
Darren

Wow, that takes some doing!!!

Well done and glad to help.

My old man was born in Heavitree, Exeter!!

Chris.

[gizmocom]

Hey, what a small world it is. My mother-in-law lives in Heavitree! (She is actually very nice and not like a stereotypical one at all!)

Darren

[milhouse]

Are you two related ??? :o :o

[Chris_Sav]

milhouse said:

Are you two related ??? :o :o

Not if he's an in-law!! but I might be related to his Mother-in-Law!! ;D

[fazza]

Ian Coleman could be his mother-in-law??