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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 10, 2011 18:42:06 GMT
About to finish now and the Oracle has not come back to me.
The Sams conversion Tommo refers to was just the slate. What this table is I really do not know, but it looks nice. There are identifyable Jelkes pieces on it, ball trap top etc, but the rest of the body of the table and the legs are not Jelkes or Sams for that matter (Sams legs are chamfered corners).
Almost tempted to bid myself but am going to exercise discretion.
Sav
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Post by Colemanator on Feb 10, 2011 19:06:00 GMT
The Cambridge one may be worth a pop at, only at £205 :-/
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2011 19:23:57 GMT
About to finish now and the Oracle has not come back to me. The Sams conversion Tommo refers to was just the slate. What this table is I really do not know, but it looks nice. There are identifyable Jelkes pieces on it, ball trap top etc, but the rest of the body of the table and the legs are not Jelkes or Sams for that matter (Sams legs are chamfered corners). Sav Surely, Sav it's identical to the top picture shown in this link? ( = Ivor Champion's website) www.bar-billiards.com/product.cfmA "Stelling Minnis SAMS table". My one is identical to the one in the bottom picture, a "Stelling Minnis Jelkes table". One hour to go on the auction. Some lucky person will land it for about £700. ;)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2011 10:20:16 GMT
So, table sold for £775 after 42 bids from 17 bidders. Sounds spot on with an oak 4-lane scoreboard (the best) thrown in. ;D So we are entitled to review what happened.......... cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160541293274The bidding that mattered all occurred in the last half-hour. - e***7 came in at 7.55pm and needed five bids to match the (hitherto hidden) reserve price. This pushed the top bid up from £400 to £600.
- f***f had been top bidder but then had to put in a serious bid.
- d***5 and d***n came in at the death, and d***n won because he had put in the best 'maximum bid'.
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Post by Colemanator on Feb 11, 2011 11:08:03 GMT
The one in Essex may be worth a look for the money, just for spares, and especially a slate.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2011 11:40:34 GMT
The one in Essex may be worth a look for the money, just for spares, and especially a slate. I can't see an Essex one there, Colemanator. Apart from the Cambridge one which has a day to go and will probably sell for around £500, I can only see the following: - A "Billard Russe" from Wakefield;
- A jaded-looking Jelkes from Stafford;
- A Burroughs and Watts from Torquay;
- A SAMS in Betchworth, Surrey (looks like an ex-Club item and will probably have a high reserve.)
The B&W in Torquay looks a good prospect for Q. ;) Burroughs and Watts are well-constructed and the vendor doesn't seem to be expecting the earth for it. 8-) cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200575121185
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Post by Colemanator on Feb 11, 2011 13:25:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2011 14:01:56 GMT
Thanks Ian. The starting price looks steep to me for something, let's face it, in kit form. Besides the 'Top', only one front leg is shown. along with the fascia and some stuff on a pallet. What guarantee is there that the remainder hasn't been run over by the fork-lift truck also shown in the picture? ;D ;D
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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 11, 2011 19:55:58 GMT
The one in Essex may be worth a look for the money, just for spares, and especially a slate. Narrow Sams, so spares no use to standard table Sav
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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 11, 2011 20:07:15 GMT
Surely, Sav it's identical to the top picture shown in this link? ( = Ivor Champion's website) www.bar-billiards.com/product.cfmA "Stelling Minnis SAMS table". My one is identical to the one in the bottom picture, a "Stelling Minnis Jelkes table". One hour to go on the auction. Some lucky person will land it for about £700. ;) Nothing like Clive. Ebay Legs are plain square and not shaped as Sams Loads of extra non Jelkes screws in a B & W like arrangement on the top The only things Ivor changed were the slate and occasionally the backboard . If I had to guess I would say it was a Jelkes with home made legs and Sams feet. If so it's had some major work on the frame to hack the leg posts out and replace them. Sav
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Post by Colemanator on Feb 11, 2011 20:34:03 GMT
The one in Essex may be worth a look for the money, just for spares, and especially a slate. Narrow Sams, so spares no use to standard table Sav Can't quite tell what it is, due to the angle of the photograph ???
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 11, 2011 20:46:13 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2011 21:08:44 GMT
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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 11, 2011 22:06:46 GMT
B & W are the most solidly constructed of the tables with a full length better supported slate, much less prone to damage. This one has seen life and the description suggests the rubbers will need replacing. The front has no clock slot so I would guess it's been panelled over. You would want to enquire of the seller if the bar that stops the balls is still in place in the table if you contemplate buying a clock Underneath there's a good table but it will take some work. This Sams looks a better condition bet if the seller is saying he will take £600, though it looks like it's been stained as it does not have that lovely Sams mahogany colour. Could be worth an offer after the usual questions on slate etc. Sav
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2011 11:17:41 GMT
This Sams looks a better condition bet if the seller is saying he will take £600, though it looks like it's been stained as it does not have that lovely Sams mahogany colour. Could be worth an offer after the usual questions on slate etc. Sav It's another former Canterbury League one, Sav, like the other one you said had dubious origins. ;D I bet if you asked the vendor "what is the wording engraved on the front of the timer, next to the handle?" back would come the reply "Property of Bar Billiards (Kent) Co, Stelling Minnis 333". Many of these can be found over in the Bristol/Avon/Wiltshire region. I would imagine they were dismantled and transferred together to start off the Pewsey League and the Avon League from stock available following the demise of the Canterbury League. When I bought mine from a private seller in Romsey, he was able to give some provenance which indicated it had spent some time in a pub in Bristol. It had around 18,000 games on the clock and I can well imagine it needing the legs replaced at one stage after being dragged in and out of various Canterbury pubs. The legs are not the standard Jelkes legs but a job lot, probably made in the 1980s. Beautifully turned oak with the wooden thread, and numbered (I think one of mine bears the number '61'.) As you say, the backboards were also replaced to blend in better with the oak of the table. The one in the picture (click on "This Sams" above) has the Sams square legs but that and the backboard are the only SAMs things about it. As you say, most SAMs are shiny mahogany. I have a vision of this one having had the leg holder threads shot to pieces, and they stuck a set of square legs on as the easiest option. Good value at the 'Buy it now' of £600, but it may be possible to land it for slightly less at the auction - if you're prepared to run the risk!
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 15, 2011 7:33:24 GMT
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 15, 2011 7:35:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2011 10:17:12 GMT
This table is probably very sound intrinsically, but the words 'pimp my ride' come to mind. The dark stain applied to the wood makes it look very old, yet the thru'penny bit legs suggest 1945- onwards. And then the white pockets on the newly covered top bring it into the 21st century! Maybe Sav and I are too 'picky', but we do like a table to look authentic. ;D Underneath that lot there's a very good Jelkes.
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 16, 2011 21:05:34 GMT
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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 16, 2011 23:26:19 GMT
I don't like the look of the marks on the underside of the slate on this one (picture 11 near the 200 hole)
Sav
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 20, 2011 14:22:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2011 14:37:04 GMT
Not for you, Huw, if you are trying to get a good one for your pub, the Cock. Too much work needs doing on it, added to which it's a Riley, with League players likely to turn their noses up at it! Set your sights on a good condition Jelkes for around £600 or a sound SAMs for around £500. ;) tommo
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 20, 2011 18:00:15 GMT
Thanks Tommo , it's for home use but still I appreciate your words of wisdom , regards Huw.
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 20, 2011 18:11:47 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2011 18:42:16 GMT
Ok Huw, When this one was listed on 11th Feb................ - A "Billard Russe" from Wakefield;
.................I was expecting an assessment from Sav, who I know to have bought a Billard Russe quite cheaply from the continent in the past and drilled out a ninth hole for it. They're solidly made and when he sold it on it was at quite a profit, I believe. ;) This one under review has already been imported, and the vendor is either trying to make a similar profit - or recoup his outlay. It could even turn out to be the very one sold by Sav! ;D Nothing wrong with it, but why not go for a standard table (Jelkes, SAMs or good condition Riley) ? Regarding the eBay bids so far, there are three bidders, all wasting their time as they are way below the reserve figure set - which at my guess is around £650. Over to Sav...............
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2011 18:59:16 GMT
Thanks Tommo , it's for home use but still I appreciate your words of wisdom , regards Huw. Wisdom huh? Glad someone seems to think so! ;D This one has ended now, and someone landed it for £390. In restrospect, the wooden frame is in excellent condition, one of the best I've ever seen on a Riley. But the reason I didn't give it a second glance before, was the horrible rip in the cloth near to where the object ball (the red) is placed. You would not be able to play a proper game of bar billiards on it without it being re-clothed. So has the winning bidder landed a bargain? That would depend a) on how cheaply he/she could get it re-covered; and b) on whether when that ghastly tear was made, no instrinsic damage was made to the slate beneath: cracked slate would equal bad news! In a fair wind could turn out to be a bargain after all! :-/
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Post by Chris_Sav on Feb 20, 2011 20:20:52 GMT
It was me that pointed out to the seller of the Billaird Russe table what it was, he had it on Ebay as a bar billiard table. If you want a seriously cheap one £120 table if you fancy a drive to Paris Sav
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Post by HORNBLOWER on Feb 20, 2011 21:52:23 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2011 22:26:14 GMT
Well done, Huw. 8-)
Landing that one for just £420 was a good bit of business. Take no notice of our picky comments about the dark stain wood and white cups - at least someone has given it some TLC recently! And the mushrooms don't seem to fall over quite as easily as pegs!
I see you now face a journey to Combe Martin in Devon to collect it. Make sure you transport it on its side (some of that spongy foam packing underneath to protect it) - and have it securely strapped to the inside of the vehicle. You don't want it jumping around in the back with the risk of damaging the slate.
tommo
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2011 22:49:36 GMT
It was me that pointed out to the seller of the Billaird Russe table what it was, he had it on Ebay as a bar billiard table. If you want a seriously cheap one £120 table if you fancy a drive to Paris Sav That has the skinniest set of legs I've ever seen, Sav, except for those of Posh Spice. ;D
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