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Post by michaelshallcross on Oct 14, 2014 16:29:43 GMT
I thought it might be a good idea to set up a thread where we can share knowledge of local tables for sale, so that the York and Sheffield leagues (and any others that might start up in Yorkshire) can help each other out with getting new teams on board. It might also be useful in helping us to avoid inadvertently bidding against each other on tables and artificially hiking the price up. Anyway, to kick off, I noticed this one for sale in Batley today, which should be convenient for Sheffield: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/bar-billiards-table-/131319803657?pt=UK_SportingGoods_SnookerPool_RL&hash=item1e93452f09Looks like it needs a bit of TLC, but could be worth a shot if the price doesn't go up too much further. |
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Post by syorksbilliards on Oct 14, 2014 17:01:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2014 17:25:28 GMT
One Jelkes, one Riley, both in average condition. Both look reasonable purchases if the price is right.  The Jelkes went for £495, the Riley for £270. Both need some work, but hey - good purchases. |
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Post by syorksbilliards on Nov 2, 2014 10:15:01 GMT
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Post by syorksbilliards on Nov 2, 2014 10:18:14 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2014 11:50:43 GMT
Yep the Boston Lincs one as you say is a modern standard Supreme. Loads of these come up on eBay and go for around £500 or less, so don't do the "Buy-it-now" option !
The Staffs one is not a SAMS but an original Jelkes, so better than advertised ! You need some assurances about the solidity of the legs (which conveniently unscrew for transportation) as the downside is that the threads can become damaged if the table is dragged across a floor rather than be carefully lifted.
Subject to an okay about that and on the soundness of the slate (ie no visible cracks) you would be justified in paying anything up to a grand for it. As far as I can see from the pictures all it needs is a leather D which you can make for yourself quite cheaply and easily.
tommo
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2014 12:06:48 GMT
Just to add on the Jelkes, worth asking if there is a set of pegs/mushrooms as this will knock you back a further 30 quid if there are none. Also, it would have been handier to see a pic of the table on its legs. If they're round it was made in the 1930's and if hexagonal it dates from the 1940's. PS I've done a check on the vendor for you, and they sound reputable: lightoaksmobility.co.uk/ |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2014 21:16:37 GMT
The Supreme was withdrawn from sale (which could mean either that a private agreement was reached - or that the vendor failed to put a decent reserve on it and got cold feet with the way the auction was going. The Jelkes went for a very creditable £430....Wonder if it's on its way to Yorkshire ?  |
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Post by michaelshallcross on Nov 14, 2014 15:39:38 GMT
I tried to drum up some local interest in the Jelkes table on Twitter, but I fear it didn't go to a York pub or I would have heard something by now... Looks like someone got a bargain!
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Post by syorksbilliards on Nov 15, 2014 10:23:31 GMT
Unfortunately did not come this way eather could not clear funds someone got a bargain
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 11:05:09 GMT
I'd say ! Reckon they got it for around half price !
A working timer alone can be worth £300.
Jelkes tables are becoming rarer and rarer, it was uncommon to get two such tables being sold in quick succession.
If a pristine condition one comes up with the post-war hexagonal legs, the AEBBA will be in for it like a shot - but they won't pay more than a grand for it.
The other makes which command a good price are standard-width SAMS (36" not 34") and Burroughs and Watts (one is shown in the recent photo of BB Warrior winning the W/Champs in Jersey).
Sadly most of the tables which come up on eBay these days seem to be either the narrower SAMs or Supremes: avoid if possible and definitely don't pay more than £500.
If you wish to build up a stock of tables in your county your best bet is probably to go for Rileys. They are less stocky/heavy than a SAMS and ones in good conditions appear from time to time. And they appear to be an untapped resource, as far as I can make out the North of England table operator held the franchise for them and he was the first to cease operating in round about 1980.
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Post by Chris_Sav on Nov 15, 2014 12:16:58 GMT
Hi Tommo
AEBBA will not be in the market for replacing table stock for the next two years, got van loans to pay off and a cash emergency reserve of £2k to get built.
I'm not fond of Rileys myself as they are not as solidly built, however there is less chance of slate damage on an Ebay Riley table, still leaves the problem of cushion rubber likely to be rock hard after many years sitting somewhere.
Sav |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 12:20:57 GMT
Hi Tommo
AEBBA will not be in the market for replacing table stock for the next two years, got van loans to pay off and a cash emergency reserve of £2k to get built.
Sav .........unless you are able to return from your visit to Holland next weekend with a huge sack stuffed with euros ! |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 12:27:56 GMT
I'm not fond of Rileys myself as they are not as solidly built, however there is less chance of slate damage on an Ebay Riley table, still leaves the problem of cushion rubber likely to be rock hard after many years sitting somewhere. Sav That's the whole point: you rarely see a league Riley (in fact they were banned from the Horsham League in the 1960's as the ones in use had easy-drop pockets) so the field is clear for Yorks. Better to build up a stock of the same type rather than have a motley assortment ! |
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Post by bigjimsilverfox on Nov 15, 2014 16:19:05 GMT
I noticed a post on Facebook from The Tanners in Horsham. The landlady is selling her table, this will be one of Tarratts tables!
She is asking for £750 for it, I know the timer is ok as I played on it a few months back, anyone interested in buying or making an offer should contact the Tanners Arms directly
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Post by syorksbilliards on Nov 16, 2014 22:36:45 GMT
Anyone seen the table in Pudsey looks nice go on a look at funds I think
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2014 22:47:33 GMT
The Pudsey one looks tip-top, but I doubt if it will go anywhere near as cheaply as the others.  |
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Post by Chris_Sav on Nov 16, 2014 22:59:19 GMT
Anyone seen the table in Pudsey looks nice go on a look at funds I think Wrong nasty pocket rings, defo cracked slate, table lock missing, Wrong leatherette suggests lack of attention to detail. I'd guess a botch-up by an amateur.
Owt else?
Table frame looks nice
Sav
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2014 23:48:01 GMT
LOL whatever Jelkes table comes up on eBay Sav is bound to pick holes in, as there are so many potential intrinsic problems with which he has become familiar over the years when re-furbing them himself.
Always advisable not to trust dealers who claim to be expert in refurbishing - the only one I'd trust is the one at Stelling Minnis.
You don't want to be landed with an expensive dud, hence the earlier suggestion to go for clean and tidy Rileys which are normally £400 to £500 and money well spent.
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Post by Chris_Sav on Nov 17, 2014 8:49:21 GMT
LOL whatever Jelkes table comes up on eBay Sav is bound to pick holes in, as there are so many potential intrinsic problems with which he has become familiar over the years when re-furbing them himself. I don't pick holes in it I give an honest appraisal, warts and all, for the benefit of members who may be taking on something they have no experience of handling. The non original front slate support half mitred to the frame is a sure indication of a slate repair, I have yet to see a wooden support repair give a flat playing surface. Always advisable not to trust dealers who claim to be expert in refurbishing - the only one I'd trust is the one at Stelling Minnis. and me??? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2014 9:25:19 GMT
But of course, mein Herr ! That should go without saying ! I was alluding to registered businesses, whereas you're not in it for the profit ! There are quite a few out there who think they can buy a table cheaply, rub down the wood and add varnish, give it a quick re-cloth and pass it off as 're-furbished' with no attention to detail and then sell at a huge profit.  |
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shaggy
Full Forum Member
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Post by shaggy on Nov 17, 2014 11:05:05 GMT
A Jelkes for sale on E Bay down in Yeovil . Starting price at £500
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Post by Chris_Sav on Nov 17, 2014 12:08:49 GMT
Far more original than the Pudsey one that raises alarm bells for me.
Usual advice of caution applies to slate, rubbers and legs.
Sav |
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Post by syorksbilliards on Dec 9, 2014 23:03:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2014 23:33:16 GMT
Raper & Sons of Manchester: manufacturer of billiards/snooker but not a wholesale manufacturer of bar billiards......
Probably did this one as a commission, because of this probably very rare !
The bad news.....yes it looks narrow. And probably badly in need of a re-cloth. (Nasty extensive tear in the cloth near where the D should be, and a sunken right hand 50 hole).
Working timer is a plus point, but I can't see a lot else in its favour.
Hopefully Sav will provide a second opinion.
tommo
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Post by Chris_Sav on Dec 10, 2014 9:07:06 GMT
I had already done a bit of research on this one as Raper $ Sons were new to me. The label does say 'supplied by' and not 'manufactured by'.
Rapers of Manchester manufactured billiards/snooker tables and there are a couple of fairly extensive histories on them. They were in decline after the second world war and only appear to have been refurbing tables for sale or rental. There is absolutely no mention of bar billiards tables in their histories. The table looks quite 'Burroughs and Watts' to me and not a narrow table. It certainly has B & W 'snooker table style' rails and cushions.
Thus without any great deal of certainty I think Rapers refurbed this, probably B & W, table in exactly the way we see tables 'manufactured' by Bar Billiards Ltd formerly of Ascot when Bar Billiards Ltd never made a table in their history but they put labels on their hire tables.
Sav
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2014 9:58:55 GMT
A far more definitive (and sensible !) assessment there from Sav.
I had spotted the Burroughes and Watts attribute by the offset handle (= timer over to the right) and am glad that it is now confirmed as standard width. The giveaways on this are usually the symmetry of the 200/50/100/50 holes (= a flattened diamond configuration on a standard top) and the value indicators for the holes (10-20-30-20-10 for narrow, 30-20-10-20-30 for normal).
But you have to be so careful with tables like this in case it has become a 'hybrid' with the top a bad match for the frame.
The vendor on eBay should really specify the dimensions to avoid confusion, but in this case it could work in your favour.....looks like one to go for after all if it's a Burroughs & Watts manufacture, and a professional re-cloth would be money well spent especially if you could pick it up cheaply.
tommo
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Post by syorksbilliards on Dec 10, 2014 11:06:13 GMT
Right thanks guys will keep a close eye on this one it dose look narrow but let's wait and see I trust in sav expert eye :)
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Post by syorksbilliards on Dec 14, 2014 22:23:14 GMT
Lost it at last minute I hate ebay
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Post by Chris_Sav on Dec 14, 2014 22:58:47 GMT
Lost it at last minute I hate ebay
Didn't go for much, if you were prepared to pay more you should have bid it at the last moment and let Fleabay determine what was needed.
Bad luck, remember we were not 100% certain of its lineage
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